[Guest]

I have just recently purchased a Smith and Wesson Model SW40VE Pistol - Allied Forces and I am wondering if I can use LE only ammo? Are they all +p+? Or are they meant for Law Enforcement pistols only? I wanted to purchase Winchester Ranger "T" bullets or Federal LE Tactical bullets for home protection.

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. Some LE ammo is +P and some is +P+ and yes, you can use them in your pistol. Since there's no SAAMI rating for +P+, I personally only use ammunition in this range from either Winchester or Federal. I have not checked on the Winchester 124-gr. Ranger +P but I think it's about the same expanding bullet design as the 127-gr. +P+ but without the "dreaded" talons.

There is no Federal law against the private citizen using LE ammunition; I am not familiar with each state's laws, but I tend to doubt that the LE designation would make it unlawful just on that basis alone.

I have used various LE ammunition as well as "regular" off-the-shelf expanding ammo and frankly, I don't think there is enough difference to fret about but go with that which you feel is the best. Confidence in the dark place is a good thing. If you have problems with getting LE ammo, Speer's 124-gr. Gold Dot +P has a very good reputation and is being used by NYPD with no complaints on its "stopping power". I believe that the NY Transit Police use the standard pressure version.

Best and welcome to the site.

 

[Guest]

Thanks. If the package does not say its +p or +p+ is it then a standard round? i was going to order them from ammunitiontogo.com or maybe wait till the saxet gun show comes to San Antonio to purchase them.

 

[Guest]

The caliber of my pistol is .40 s&w.

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. Yes, I overlooked that but for the most part, the .40 S&W ammo is available in parallel loads from the same companies but w/o any +P or +P+ loadings or ratings as the more modern round is already loaded about as hot as it safely can be.

Best and good luck.

PS: FWIW, Winchester's "old technology" 155-gr. STHP has proven itself a good protection round and I found it to be accurate in most .40's I've tried during my brief flirtation with the round.

 

[mbott]

There is no Federal law against the private citizen using LE ammunition; I am not familiar with each state's laws, but I tend to doubt that the LE designation would make it unlawful just on that basis alone.

In the case of Winchester, they "expect" that their dealers will honor the agreement not to allow their Ranger T-series ammo to be sold to non-LEOs.

On a related note, I had the opportunity to attend a Winchester factory demo of their Ranger ammo and the new enhanced Ranger T-series ammo just a couple of weeks ago. Their Ranger ammo was very impressive against the competition.

Of course, Winchester did not supply the ammo they were "shooting against" as it was up to the various agencies that attended to bring in what they were using. This way there could be no hint of them tampering with the non-Winchester duty rounds.

--
Mike

 

[twoguns]

Howdy folks,

That is interesting Mr. Mike, that Winchester holds that expectation of dealers. Candidly over the course of 35 years as a LEO, you are the first person to ever make that statement. I am not doubting it in the least, just surprised I have never heard it before now. I am wondering if it is a new company philosophy for some reason - any idea?

I am not aware of any federal law that would prohibit civilians from using ammo marked as LE only, as Mr. Steve noted. Since I spent many years ordering ammo for various agencies I worked for as the head instructor for that office, I have also noticed a "trend" in my view anyway, on LE marked ammo. Normally on the ammo lists I ordered off of, LE only marked rounds were packaged in boxes of either 50 (normal) or 25 (rarer) for handgun ammo. So I have basically felt it was more of an in-house designation for the manufacturers to refer to 50 round boxes more than anything else. At least based on the government ammo lists I have looked at for years.

I will add one comment on one specific +P+ round that we encountered in the past. My agency issued the Speer Gold Dot 9mm loads in standard and +P (both 124gr), and +P+ (115gr) so folks could carry the round they felt best armed with. We quickly discovered the +P+ loads were damaging the rollers in our issued MP-5s. Once we discovered that, as the MP-5 is in my view a very hardy weapon, the decision was made to no longer issue the +P+ loading for duty use of any kind.

I am a big fan of Speer Gold Dot ammo personally. But based on this situation, I have simply elected not to use any +P+ loading, as I simply feel most major brands of ammo in various calibers in either standard or +P loads will do fine for me. Again, this is just my view, but I wanted to offer it for what it is worth.

twoguns

 

[pff]

The usual reason +P+ ammo is so marked is, since it exceeds SAAMI specs on pressure, there's hopefully some standard of weapons inspection and maintenance in place, which wouldn't be the case in normal commerce.

The other ammo being marked LE-Only can be for any number of reasons, logical or not.


Regards,

Pat

 

[oberstlt]

I am not aware of a +P or +P+ loading for 40 S&W. I thought it was already there.

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. There is no +P or +P+ for the .40 S&W. Being a relatively new cartridge intended for police service with no older guns previously existing for it, it is loaded to the upper safe end of its pressure capabilities in standard form.

Best.