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Gents,

I've preached for years that defensive handguns need to be instinctive...a point and click interface under stress.
As you noted from a previous post I was wearing/using/testing a Beretta 92 Compact and I'm here to tell you that has ended. Probably for good. Here's why.
Let me back up and say that I use the Beretta safety as a decocker only and carry the weapon off safe in the DA mode. This due to my lifelong association with 1911's and Hi-Powers. I instinctively swipe the safeties down to fire and simply can't transition to the reverse "up/off safe" mode. Not to mention I have very short thumbs that make this problematic.
What really sealed the deal was finding the weapon had worked itself back into the "on safe" position twice in the past few days. No longer the natural point and click interface I desired.
I'll probably keep the pistol as a example of the breed, but it will end there.
Just my .02 worth and something for you to watch for on the B92/96 series. If you can work the safeties on the Beretta, Smith's, etc. that's fine. I can't, don't, and won't.

Semper Fi,

Wes
 

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Mr. Wes,

I have read a couple of your previous posts, where I could tell you had a real fondness for this pistol. So in that respect I am sorry you have been forced to retire it to your safe.

On the other hand, I am very glad you discovered it as you did. That is not something I would want the investigating detective to note in his report, concerning the condition your pistol was found in on the ground beside you. You understand me I think, but folks that is not a statement I mean in jest.

It is important I think to note, it is not only the Beretta series of pistols that can possibly happen with either. I think that is certain a possibility for any pistol that sports a safety/decocking lever of that type in its controls.

Back around 1990 my agency made a full transition away from issuing either a 3" 686 revolver or a Smith 6906. It decided everyone would be issued the 6906. There are some advantages to that decision really, as now everyone is carrying the same ammo in the event some would need to be shared.

But that can also be the type of thing that can make a firearms instructor turn grey, or more grey in my case, lol. The hardest point for me to make to the revolver shooters, many of whom had never fired a pistol before, that it required one deliberate down (to decock) and up (to remove the safety) motion before holstering their pistol.

I would watch several of the new folks holster a safed pistol, and remind everyone to make sure they had moved their lever back up after decocking. I would watch heads nodding yes, give the command to fire, then watch them draw and attempt to fire the next stage. Usually not able to figure out why the pistol would not fire - they had left the lever down in safe mode. Several did magazine exchanges and still had not realized they had not taken their gun out of safe mode yet.

To try to drive the point home more clearly, on the range I began to tell them to make sure they were operating their "deadman lever" properly. That seemed to help a bit.

But it is important I think for folks to learn to operate the lever properly. And then to be aware that is can possibly go into safe mode without a great deal of effort sometimes.

So Mr. Wes thank you for making what I think is a very valuable point, that I hope others using similarly safety/decocking lever pistols will make note of.

twoguns
 

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I wonder if the hammer drop only type safety from the G series could be placed in the regular 92's? If so, this would eliminate your problems and concerns and save a really good pistol from a fate worse than death-being shut away in a safe for good!
 

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Demented, I remember reading that there's a different cut inside the slide of the G Series guns, or something like that, which makes it impossible to swap safety mechanisms between them and the conventional F and FS models.

(And parenthetically, Beretta has always refused to sell the G Series guns to non-LEOs, for some strange reason. The local Gander Mtn. had some trade in 96Gs a while back, darn near picked one up for the novelty of it!)

Edited to fix funny mistake above: I called the store "Ganger Mtn." the other day, where was my brain at?
 

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I have a G that I bought from an ex deputy sheriff a few years back. Had no idea they were police only. Strange, guess Beretta doesn't trust us civillians to have sense enough not to pull the trigger too early.
 

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I like my Beretta 92 Brigadier and have had no problems with the safety. I carry the gun the same way Wes does.

That said, I decided to try a new holster and found that when placing the gun in the holster, the upper lip of the holster would return the safety to the down position. I spent about fifteen minutes trying to figure out how to solve the problem without modifying the holster, but I gave up and determined simply never to use it again. I'll keep the gun, I'll carry it some, and I'll trust it. Just not with that holster...
 

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I've handled Beretta's several times (military version), and I have never been able to: (a) get my hand around the grip, (b) reach the trigger in its forward DA position, and (c) work that safety upwards. My hands are not small for a male, but why in the world the Army picked a pistol that (in these "inclusive" days), fit so many fewer hand sizes than the so-called "real man's pistol"; the 1911-A1 is beyond me. I've seen women less than five foot, with short pudgy fingers handle a .45 just fine. I had the same problem with an S&W 69. An early 1006 worked much better, so it appears that it's the "around the corner" combination of fat grips and slide mounted "upwards to release"safeties that affects me.
 

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Wes;
I can assure you, you are not alone. In military classes we see this constantly.

People put them on and forget it. People inadvertently wipe them on when holstering (especially in the Safariland 6004 - though it is not the holster that is doing it). And people put them on when retracting the slide.

That dingus will definitely detract from your "survival quotient" :-/

Jim H.
 

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The only time I had problems was when 'slingshotting' the slide. Disconcerting to do an 'immediate action' drill and find the safety engaged.

Guy I got it from needed it back, so it got traded. (For a 586 in .38 Special !!)

Regards,

Pat
 

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[quote:72nqoin0] . . . . . a 586 in .38 Special !!)
Really??!!!! Your item would be quite valuable to a Smith collector.


[/quote:72nqoin0]

Indeed. If it has a 4 1/4" barrel (as opposed to 4 or 6") there are only a few over 200 of them. This might mean I now know where two of them are ;)

Jim H.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Gents,

While I've seen the safety inadvertently engaged it has usually been from the "overhand " cycling of the slide and not the "slingshot" method. The slingshot tends to pinch the safety and hold it in position.
As noted...regardless, it detracts from your survival quotient.
Maybe I should just get a Sig?

Wes
 

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Hello Wes,

As I've discovered lately in my search for the "quinessential handgun" that you really have a lot of options in the SIGARMS line as far as size, caliber and capacity. I bought my P-239 for concealed carry followed very quickly by a P-226R.

I had to trade/and or sell several lesser "quality" firearms to get into the purchase, but I personally find too much to like in the SIGARMs line.

My initial shooting impressions with the P-239 confirmed everything I'd heard about the quality and accuracy of their handguns.

I DO like the Beretta line and have owned a couple.

I just plain like SIG's better.

(particularly in .357 SIG)

Chris
 

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Mr. Wes,

Personally sir, I think you could do much worse than a Sig, for sure. On the plus side, they have recently begun to offer some models with a steel frame. They have finally offered stainless as an option on a few models as well. These two options simply turned a great pistol into an incredible one for me.

I was recently checking their site and knew they offered the P226 in steel/stainless in all 3 calibers, and the P220 in steel/stainless. I smiled when I discovered they now have a P229 in steel/stainless in all 3 calibers too.

Hard to argue with Mr. Chris at all, and if ordered in 357 Sig, you can just add the other two barrels if that urge ever strikes. I am so impressed with my steel framed 226R, I am thinking seriously about trying to upgrade (trade with my dealer) my 229 to a steel framed model 229 too. Or maybe just use it to get another 226R in steel. So many Sig options now.

twoguns
 

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Hello Wes,

Yes, the Beretta Compact would make a "handsome" trade towards a down payment on a SIG. I've never had much stock in a pistol that I've decided not to shoot or carry for whatever the reason.

Once I am done with a handgun, I am done with it unless it has some historic value for collecting purposes.

I see a SIG coming into your life soon.

Chris
 
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I really like my Sig 226R in 9mm, but I prefere a pistol that I have the option to carry cocked and locked. I wish Sig would make a line of DA pistols with a seperate safety and decocker. That would be a dream gun for me. But, back to the thread, when I carried my Beretta 96 I would just carry it with the safety on. I have long thumbs, though, so clicking off the safety was no problem. I just think it's better to be used to clicking it off when you draw. If it somehow wiggles itself off safe it's not a big deal. If the safety gets wiggled on and you're not used to clicking that sucker off you could be worm food.
 

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Hello Weshowe,

Sorry for the late answer - a lot to do here! - but your post really touches me as I'm an afficionado of the 92 Compact. In my opinion, it is the best of the 92 breed, despite the thick slide and grip, and I owned 3 (1 SB and 2 FS) along the years, without experiencing 1 malfunction...

Even if it wouldn't my first choice for ccw (academic question here) and I would rather go for the .45 LW Commander or 9 mm Walther P5, you should check your safety, if the safety pin spring hasn't got loose. You should also check your hoster. In my opinion, holsters should cover the safety on the bodyside. That involves a bodyshield in the case of slide safety pistols like Berettas, Ruger or SW.

These are not critics on your rig or habits but only suggestions as I feel really sorry you get disappointed for that great gun.

Bye.

L.
 
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